[ale] I've decided again to learn programming again

Fri Oct 14 19:33:47 EDT 2011

On Fri, 2011-10-14 at 14:16 -0400, Scott Castaline wrote: 

> On 10/14/2011 10:59 AM, Byron Jeff wrote:
> > On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 06:42:11AM -0400, Ron Frazier wrote:
> >> Hello all,
> >>
> >> Those of you that have read some of my prior posts know I've been
> >> threatening for some time to relearn programming after 16 years out of
> >> the loop.  I discussed it here before, and we had discussions about the
> >> various merits, or unmerits of different languages.  I really was
> >> planning to learn C++, after you guys convinced me to not target C#.  I
> >> have, sitting next to me, some of the best C++ textbooks out there,
> >> including one by the inventor of C++.  The problem is, no disrespect to
> >> the authors, that these things are BORING, and intimidating.  I mean, I
> >> have to go through 400 pages of for next loops, if then's, and variable
> >> setting, etc. to even get to putting a GUI hello world program on the
> >> screen.  And, that's IF they even discuss GUI programming.  Now, I know
> >> you have to learn the basics, and I know these things are foundational,
> >> but I think this is the least enticing way to teach it.
> > The real problem is that there is a functional disconnect between
> > foundational programming concepts and GUI programming. GUIs are event
> > driven creatures that rarely have a linear flow. We run into this problem
> > all the time teaching introductory programming and invariably end up right
> > back at linear console programming to teach basic concepts. It's difficult
> > to branch out to non-linear event driven programming without a clear
> > understanding of basic programming concents.
> That was my problem in the late 80's early 90's ( I maybe off a couple 
> of years), I was making an attempt to "relearn programming". Prior to 
> that I had done school projects in the mid to late 70's Cobol, and 
> Assembler (6800, Harris, and there was another machine in there 
> somewhere). My attempts to relearn hit a major roadblock when I tried 
> "Event Driven Code", to me it was another term for Spaghetti Code. My 
> gray matter turned into something worse than Spaghetti Junction and I 
> gave up.

The little event driven code I have written was not messy when I kept
the GUI's well organized and relatively clean. One the problems I
noticed was a lack of good information about what makes a good GUI and
how the various parts should interface with each other. 

Also, do the tools allow you to design the GUI visually then write the
code. I found this worked well for me and I have not written any code.

> >>   Not only that,
> >> programming desktop computers doesn't excite me nearly as much now as it
> >> did a decade and a half ago when it was relatively new.  Embedded
> >> programming interests me to a point, and I could do that in C++
> >> sometimes, but I don't necessarily want to be programming thermostats
> >> and microwave ovens either.  Robotics interests me, but it can be very
> >> difficult and expensive to develop your own robotics lab.
> >>
> >> The other thing that interests me that I might be able to start
> >> development for on my own, is mobile computing, specifically Android.  I
> >> recently heard that Android is the most popular smart phone OS on the
> >> planet.  And, it's pretty much the only game in town for non IOS
> >> tablets.  The thing is, you program Android in Java.  So, I have to
> >> choose between Java and C++ since I cannot really learn two languages at
> >> once.  So, I've decided to jump over to Java, before investing lots of
> >> time in C++, which I may come back to later.  By the way, my
> >> introductory Java and Android books are just as boring as the C++ books,
> >> but I guess I'll muddle through.
> >>
> >> So, having said all that, do you guys have any thoughts on setting up a
> >> cross platform Java development environment, learning Java, learning
> >> Android, etc.  I'm thinking using the Sun / Oracle JDK on both Windows
> >> and Linux, plus the Eclipse IDE, and whatever device emulators the
> >> Android books recommend.  When I can, I'll get an Android tablet to try
> >> things out on.  I have two good books on Android 2 from Apress.  They've
> >> now come out with similar books on Android 3.  All of them say to learn
> >> Java first though.  I think there will be a lot of Android 2 out there
> >> for a while, so it might be fine to start with the books I have.  Any
> >> thoughts and advice are appreciated.
> >>
> >> Maybe, someday 8-( I'll see a GUI hello world that I created on a tablet
> >> device.  The very large learning curve for this is intimidating and
> >> frustrating.
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >> -- 
> >>
> >> (PS - If you email me and don't get a quick response, you might want to
> >> call on the phone.  I get about 300 emails per day from alternate energy
> >> mailing lists and such.  I don't always see new messages very quickly.)
> > I have to run. I'll come back to the rest of this thread a bit later.
> >
> > BAJ
> >
> >> Ron Frazier
> >>
> >> 770-205-9422 (O)   Leave a message.
> >> linuxdude AT c3energy.com
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Ale mailing list
> >> Ale at ale.org
> >> http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale
> >> See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at
> >> http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ale mailing list
> Ale at ale.org
> http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale
> See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at
> http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo

-- 
Jay Lozier
jslozier at gmail.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mail.ale.org/pipermail/ale/attachments/20111014/e8f544b6/attachment-0001.html 