[ale] OT: Re: posting to Linux mail list

[Geoffrey]

Greg wrote:

>> As I understand it, the older Office products will not run on XP.
>> Also, you can't compare your usage to the generic office drone.
>> You're much more knowledgable, whereas corporations seem to be on
>> the "upgrade cause it's there" path.
> 
> 
> True, though I swear I don't understand it or even the "we need
> support" when you only call once a year but pay $$$$ - and then it
> could be for something that will not change or can't change.

Agreed.

>> Agreed.  But then why did people ever leave Windows 3.11??
> 
> 
> Crappy assed gui and I think no plug and play.  Windows 95 was a huge
>  upgrade (and worth it) but it still was not as good as MacOS (but a
> hell of a lot cheaper to run). I think Windows 98 added stability,
> but I cannot remember.

I don't see any difference between 95 and 98 stability wise.

>> perltk
> 
> 
> I went to http://www.pconline.com/~erc/perltk.htm and saw all of the
> stuff for a simple window.  Jeepers.  Too much code for a simple
> window.  What is needed for developers is a simple window object that
> does not need all of this code - like VB. With simple pull down boxes
> on an IDE that will add a menubar and it's contents.  A dev
> environment that is simple and elegant like the language.  Better
> than VB.  Comes with libs that run on all hardware and OS's and is
> perpetually backward compatible (must be part of mission statement or
> something like Debian's structure).  Something simple and elegant
> that can be taught to high schoolers.  Makes gui's easily and 
> effortlessly.  Able to connect to db's with a single click.  Controls
> access and secure.  Comes with stuff pre-done for often used code
> purposes like input validation, db connection, etc...  Updateable
> like apt-get.  Free like linux (not BSD) to keep corporations from
> horning in too much.  Powerful IDE like Visual Studio.  Can take any
> compiler you give it a path to and run it against any code you wrote
> in the IDE like TextPad or plugins for Visual Studio or Eclipse (?).
> Whether the MS CLR, perl, python, C, C++, whatever you got.
> 
> Yes, this would be a killer app.

Ah, you want the Holy Grail. :)  Seriously, there are IDE's out ther for 
perl and other languages that do a lot of what you want, just none that 
do it all.

Personally, I've never found an IDE that would give me 100% of what I 
wanted.  Either I'd get 80% and then have to hack the code to get the 
other 20%, or I'd have to settle for the 80%.

>> Understood, but these are unique needs.  The general office complex
>> can get buy with a Microsoft-less environment.
> 
> 
> I would agree if requirements were written in functionality or even
> if separated.  If security is a reason for a Windows/NT place to
> upgrade I would just suggest a *nix firewall.  Total cost is cheap
> box + time. Perhaps some stuff on the firewall to take out any
> dangerous attachments and able to run on a 2 nic or 3 nic (if a
> public net is needed) old box with good firewall rules.  Maybe a
> corporate version of a virus checker with updates for all
> workstations.  Take out the floppy drives in all of the pc's so stuff
> doesn't get brought in from home and lock the cases. If any software
> is under service contract replace it with OS stuff (if it breaks/is 
> unreliable) or blow off the service contracts.  Many consultants love
>  maintenance contracts since even on MS stuff there aren't enough
> calls to justify the cost.  What I think is bought in many (not all)
> cases is peace of mind.

Agreed for the most part.  I always look for any opportunities to 
suggest a non-Microsoft solution.  You can't go with such all the time, 
I know, but when the 'window' is opened, throw it out. ;)

-- 
Until later, Geoffrey	esoteric at 3times25.net

Building secure systems inspite of Microsoft