[ale] a good Fri afternoon OT post...

[aaron]

On Friday 12 July 2002 16:38, you wrote:
[snip]
> I remember having to take this stupid career
> planning/ethics class in HS where they said you should
> never take so much as a paperclip home from the office
> (nor user the copier, etc.).

The fact that you label your HS ethics class as "stupid" is a powerful 
proof of the modern populist movement to devalue and demean all measures 
of social conscience and responsibility; ethical behvior tends to 
interfere with the practice of unbounded avorice and rabid consumerism. 
To my view, it is obvious that this encouraged ignorance [ignore-ance] of 
ethics, more than anything, is the source of the present systemic 
corruptions and disintegrations of our nation's most prominent 
institutions. Any real public discussion and consideration of ethics is 
almost totally lacking in our increasingly illiterate, greedy, arrogant 
and nationalist 'Amurikan' society, and the dire consequences of this are 
nowhere better exemplified than through our country's present commander 
in thief (and all his close company).

Unfortunately for humanity,  the concepts of ethics and morality have 
largely been usurped by and/or relegated to various religious 
institutions. The perpetual global history of wars, murder, torture, 
political oppression, theivery, fraud, corruption, racism, sexism and 
sexual abuse perpetuated through these generally patriarchal and always 
self-omnipotent organizations may some day provide an indication of how 
well THAT method of promoting ethical and moral behavior works.

> ...without pointing out that
> my employer has no problem with me using my personal
> cell phone, PC, cable modem, etc. for them w/o
> reimbursement (whoops, I guess I just did:)

Perhaps if your employers had been exposed to the concepts of ethics in 
"stupid" high school classes, they could recognize and avoid these 
unethical disparities in their expectations of you.  [grin]

> 1.  what's the MOST valueable item you ever got from
> work?  I work w/a guy who took home an HP9000 which we
> honestly were going to sell for salvage but we're also
> the ones who says what's obsolete & needs upgrading

At various times I have salvaged fairly valuable monitors, electronic 
parts, recording materials and furniture items that were being discarded 
by companies I worked for. I always received permission from an 
appropriate manager first, and in no case was I involved in the decisions 
to discard the items I received (: because that, of course, would be 
unethical :).

However, I wasn't always so mindful of honesty and integrity, and can 
remember 3 occasions in my junior high / high school days where I 
knowingly received stolen property from friends (including one where the 
item was stolen via the dumpster method). I was actually caught and 
punished in the first of those cases, but that did not deter me from the 
others. Still, I sincerely believe that if I had received a broader 
exposure to some reasonable considerations of ethics in my education, I 
would have refused to become involved in any of those situations. And 
while I doubt that I would ever have ethically resolved to report my 
unscrupulous friends to authorities, I am certain that I would have been 
actively working to dissuade them from stealing.

> 2.  have you or anyone you've ever worked with gotten
> in trouble for taking something home?

For taking something home and returning it later or salvaging "junk" from 
a dumpster, no. I have witnessed one instance where a fellow employee of 
a larger corporate operation was fired for stealing office property that 
they had no intention of returning.

> 3.  just in a broad sense what are your thoughts on
> this topic?

I think I covered the broad sense above... [grin]
...but on the more specific topic of salvaging company discards:
    The smarter and more ethical companies I have worked for had 
established salvage policies for the benefit of their employee community. 
These always involved publically posting notice of potentially valuable 
items to be discarded, and then holding lotteries or auctions to fairly 
select the recipients.

----------
My own experience is that common frameworks of ethics and morality are 
much easier to define, impart, defend and honor when their motivation is 
founded in the reason and necessity of these concepts instead of seeking 
to justify them through myth, superstition and fear of consequence.

peace
(after justice)
aaron


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