[ale] OT: H1B

Thu Dec 19 11:13:10 EST 2002

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>That's a sensible view point.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>Â  I just fear that people who vote
libertarian as opposed to republican at this point will prove to be
spoilers.Â  

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>As for democrats I find it hard to respect
a party that seems to have as one of it's main policies: "Bash Conservatives"

<span style='font-size:
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I'm reminded of this, this AM as
Bill Clinton says the Republican Party has a racist agenda.Â  It's a conspiracy: they are out to
keep black people down.

He didn't hint at this, he didn't
elude to it.Â  The words actually
came out of his mouth. Â Speaking
about Trent Lott's wonderfully phrased praise of Strom Thurmond.

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
9.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>"I think what they are really upset
about is that he made public their strategy."

<span style='font-size:
9.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>"They try to suppress black voting"

<span style='font-size:
9.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>"trying to run black voters away from
the polls"<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><a
href="http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/12/18/clinton.lott/index.html">http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/12/18/clinton.lott/index.html

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>This is unfounded and inflammatory, and
these are the remarks of a former president.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>Â  

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>From some talk show host or political correspondent
or Sean Penn is one thing.Â  

But from a former Commander in Chief. Sheesh.

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>>I will get flames no matter what I
have to do.<

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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It's likely that some politicians (in
every party) have some racist or prejudicial belief.Â  They are simply people after all, but
organized conspiracy to keep blacks from voting.

Be serious Bill.Â  Â I think he casts shadow on anything else
he says when he fabricates things as such.

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The article is interesting in that it
highlights several vocal democrats desire to move on from the issue.<span
style='mso-spacerun:yes'>Â  

Perhaps we should all be happy that the
world is calm enough at present for Lott's stupid remarks to be this
newsworthy.

<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Russ

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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style='mso-spacerun:yes'>Â 

<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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<span style='font-size:
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<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:navy;mso-no-proof:yes'>

_ __________________ _
ctcrreho at opm.gov

-----Original Message-----
From: Eichler, Paula J.
[mailto:pja0 at cdc.gov] 
Sent: <st1:date
Month="12" Day="19" Year="2002">Thursday, December 19, 2002 <st1:time
Hour="10" Minute="47">10:47 AM
To: 'ale at ale.org'
Subject: RE: [ale] OT: H1B

<span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Â 

OK, you've got me
there.Â  Not all Americans are like
that.

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

As for Rep vs. Dem, I
usually try to go Libertarian where possible.Â  Democrat if I have to.Â  Republicans just don't represent me in
any way.Â  Look at how they've carved
up the Bill of Rights lately.Â  Talk
about losing our way of life !!!Â 
The only piece we have left is the second amendment, which they give us
because it doesn't mean anything for them to give it.Â  Libertarians wouldn't have done this to

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>To answer your question,
our ideals are much more important than any temporary threat ..pj

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Â 

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----
From: Hogg, Russell E
[mailto:ctcrreho at opm.gov] 
Sent: <st1:date
Month="12" Day="19" Year="2002"><span
 style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Thursday, December 19, 2002<font
size=2 face=Tahoma> <st1:time
Hour="10" Minute="22"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
 font-family:Tahoma'>10:22 AM<span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
To: 'ale at ale.org'
Subject: RE: [ale] OT: H1B

<span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Â 

<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:
12.0pt;margin-left:1.0in'><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Â 

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>" Americans kill me sometimes "

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Hey now, don't judge us all like that.Â  There are
what maybe several hundred people on this list, only a few have stepped off the
deep end with their blame of immigrants for their problems.Â  For what it's
worth most of them are probably out of a high paying job.Â  Well I've been
there before so it's ok with me if they vent a little.Â  

My guess is that their views would be much more
moderate and based on logic and understanding if they weren't worried about
where the next mortgage payment is coming from.

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>A lot of the posters, and the probably the vast majority
of the folks on the list, have very reasonable viewpoints.Â  

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>As for voting Republican/Conservative, that's the only
real choice you have.Â  If we flit away our economic advantage then our way
of life will go with it.Â  For what it's worth Liberal economic policy (or
maybe even understanding) has been trounced on this list several times
lately.Â  

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>(Grant Robertson going 1 against 3 or 4 if memory
serves) 

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>My guess is that most of the people on the list who
vote liberal do so because they believe in the social policies of the
Democratic Party.Â  I certainly hope this is the case, as opposed to a
belief that they are a victim of some sort of conservative conspiracy, as a
couple of posters here have said.Â  (Rich people don't pay taxes is the
quote that comes to mind.)

I think I can safely say that one of the tenements of
success is not "think of your self as a victim".

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>In a general sense I tend to agree with conservative
social ideals as well.Â  The difference is that I don't have specific facts
that support my beliefs like I do with economics.Â  

On the next issue raised: how far are we willing to
go?Â  Sure following every immigrant from a terrorist harboring country
sounds like a good idea.Â  But how far do you take it?Â  Don't you
think they'll just a find a way to start coming as French Citizens if we stop
them from coming from Arabic countries. (those darn French!) And hey all this
shit costs money too.Â  Money that isn't feeding the hungry or educating
the poor.Â

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>The truth is that being free carries with it a whole
lot of risk.Â  A scary amount of risk.Â  And we have to decide how free
or un-free we are willing to be.Â  

Remember, racial profiling works, but it's prejudice
in action. 
Whats worth more?Â  Our
security or our ideals?Â

Think of the big picture before you answer.Â  We
have a responsibility to the generations that follow us.

Ok somebody post that Ben Franklin quote now.

My last post garnered me no flames, I trust this one
will do better.

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Russ 

<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:
12.0pt;margin-left:1.0in'><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Â 

<span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Â  
Â  
Â  
Â  
_ __________________ _

ctcrreho at opm.gov 
Â  

<span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>

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