<html><head></head><body>After a few weeks, you won't notice the noise.<br>
<br>
Won't hear much else after a decade around this kind of gear, too :-(<br>
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They are NOT silent when at idle and can be unpleasant at full load.<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On April 14, 2016 4:07:02 PM EDT, "Beddingfield, Allen" <allen@ua.edu> wrote:<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<pre class="k9mail">The fan noise on these is going to be an issue. Think something like the sound level of a small window unit air conditioner.<br />Allen B.<br />--<br />Allen Beddingfield<br />Systems Engineer<br />Office of Information Technology<br />The University of Alabama<br />Office 205-348-2251<br />allen@ua.edu<br /><br /><hr /><br />From: ale-bounces@ale.org [ale-bounces@ale.org] on behalf of Alex Carver [agcarver+ale@acarver.net]<br />Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2016 3:02 PM<br />To: ale@ale.org<br />Subject: Re: [ale] [OT] good hardware for a learner!<br /><br />What interests me about these servers is the dual NIC. I have the<br />similar thought about the fans as Scott because one of these would be<br />perfect as my firewall/gateway/NAT box. I was otherwise looking at a<br />fanless dual-NIC Intel NUC box for the same purpose.<br /><br />On 2016-04-14 12:26, Karenga Smith wrote:<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border
-left:
1px solid #729fcf; padding-left: 1ex;"> Wow interesting I may have to consider getting one myself!<br /> Thanks<br /><br /> On Thu, Apr 14, 2016 at 8:11 AM, Jim Kinney <jim.kinney@gmail.com<br /> <mailto:jim.kinney@gmail.com>> wrote:<br /><br /> On the whole, I agree with all of what was said. Server gear is designed to<br /> RUN FOREVER and desktop gear is designed to SELL IN THE MILLIONS. Totally<br /> different engineering viewpoints.<br /><br /> For the beginner Linux newbie, I would argue the server is the hardware to<br /> learn on for the aspiring professional. That said, any decent machine will<br /> provide expertise in Linux skilz :-)<br /><br /> Buying a used server for $200 beats the used desktop for the same price from<br /> a professional standpoint in most cases. Unless the plan is to do big<br /> graphic processing for artists doing 3D design, desktops are generally<br /> disposable crap hardware. The server
gear
_is_ more costly not just because<br /> of quantity price issues but because of engineered robustness.<br /><br /> Dual power supplies don't pull much more power that a single one. The total<br /> load is split between the two plus a tiny fraction for monitoring and<br /> inefficiency losses.<br /><br /> The power used by servers is what ever load is required of them. The Intel<br /> systems will use more power per cpu flop than the Opteron ones. All can<br /> throttle back clock speed to cut power when unused.<br /><br /> Fan noise on 1U machines is a problem. Desktops have huge fans and can turn<br /> slower to move the same amount of air and thus less noise.<br /><br /> IPMI ports should NEVER be wired up to touch LAN or certainly not Internet<br /> networks. Some Dells have a shared ILO/nic which kills using one nic for<br /> much of anything.<br /><br /> But ipmi is really cool!<br /><br /> On Apr 14, 2016 7:27 AM,
"DJ-Pfulio" <djpfulio@jdpfu.com<br /> <mailto:djpfulio@jdpfu.com>> wrote:<br /><br /> "Server" hardware has many downsides.<br /> * Power use - often these things have redundant PSUs; Server power use<br /> has been<br /> reduced greatly, but is still higher than desktops (for good reason).<br /> * Heat - more power become more heat. Think about the July/August<br /> electric bill.<br /> * Noise - ever been inside a data center? Noise isn't **any** consideration.<br /> * Higher cost of upgrades/replacement parts, usually.<br /><br /> A few pluses:<br /> * Huge amount of RAM / ECC RAM<br /> * Server-class CPUs<br /> * Rack mounting (may not be a plus)<br /><br /> But Jim is right. Sometimes there are things that only server machines have<br /> which are worth having hands-on experience with - IPMI for example. How<br /> do lock<br /> t
hat
down, since almost all IPMI has huge security issues.<br /> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_Platform_Management_Interface">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_Platform_Management_Interface</a><br /><br /> Some of the Core i7 and multi-core AMD desktop CPUs are really<br /> impressive, so<br /> getting a "server" CPU isn't that important for a home user. Of course, they<br /> will use lots of power too, when a 53W system might be all that is required.<br /><br /> ECC RAM - if you run ZFS, get ECC RAM. Lots of it. Some desktop MBs<br /> support ECC<br /> and I have a hard time thinking of what someone at home would do with<br /> 32G of RAM<br /> inside a system. Met a guy with 96G of RAM in his box, but he was running<br /> Windows. From what he described, sounded like 8G of RAM would have been<br /> overkill<br /> to me. So he was stuck with this
server-class box, 5+ yr old CPUs and<br /> 96G of<br /> RAM that a new Core i7 would have blown away for $1K total system cost.<br /><br /> The point is that home server hardware to learn on isn't bad when it is<br /> cheap,<br /> but if you spend $4k+ on it, you'll find that it is like an albatross<br /> following<br /> you around for years.<br /><br /> It is noisy and sucks 2x-4x more power than a desktop system.<br /><br /><br /> On 04/13/2016 11:23 PM, Scott M. Jones wrote:<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"> Does it have a loud fan? That might be the down side...<br /><br /> On Apr 12, 2016, at 5:00 PM, Jim Kinney <jim.kinney@gmail.com<br /></blockquote> <mailto:jim.kinney@gmail.com><br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left
:
1ex;"> <mailto:jim.kinney@gmail.com <mailto:jim.kinney@gmail.com>>> wrote:<br /><br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> I don't push hardware unless it's mine or I'm just drooling over it.<br /><br /> However....<br /><br /> <a href="http://ebay.to/1VSdviy">http://ebay.to/1VSdviy</a><br /><br /> That's a bitly link to an ebay listing for several Dell 1U systems.<br /></blockquote></blockquote> They have<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> the basics of everything to get jumping on Linux from power<br /></blockquote></blockquote> management to<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left:
1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> virtualization all for $213 (including shipping). These are<br /></blockquote></blockquote> reliable, solid<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> machines that are out of date for current commercial use (DDR2 RAM<br /></blockquote></blockquote> is far more<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> costly that DDR3 per GB) but perfect for someone who wants<br /></blockquote></blockquote> server-class gear<br /><blockquote class="gmail
_quote"
style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> at home to learn on.<br /><br /> I usually get supermicro but they all have odd quirks that make them<br /></blockquote></blockquote> a pain.<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> New ones are a great deal on that price/power/pain curve. Dell is<br /></blockquote></blockquote> over priced<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #ad7fa8; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 1ex 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid #8ae234; padding-left: 1ex;"> when new. IBM is stupidly over pr
iced
new (and used!).<br /><br /> Just my $0.02<br /></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><br /><hr /><br />Ale mailing list<br />Ale@ale.org<br /><a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale</a><br />See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<br /><a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo</a><br /><br /><hr /><br />Ale mailing list<br />Ale@ale.org<br /><a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale</a><br />See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<br /><a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo</a><br /><br /></pre></blockquote></div><br>
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