<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 TRANSITIONAL//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; CHARSET=UTF-8">
<META NAME="GENERATOR" CONTENT="GtkHTML/4.6.5">
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Ethanol content can be harmful to rubber and plastic parts in the fuel system. Cars since sometime in 80's have been designed with gas being up to 10% ethanol.<BR>
<BR>
My complaint with the EPA requirements is that they never fully thought out. Often fuel regulations are promulgated without considering chemical attack on parts in existing vehicles. The EPA is considering raising the ethanol requirement to 15%. Whether an engine will tolerate the increase could be problematic and there is the possibly of the owner being on the hook for expensive repairs. Often regulators ignore chemical attack and corrosion when writing their rules and do not factor material failure as part of the cost of the regulation.<BR>
<BR>
-----Original Message-----<BR>
<B>From</B>: Michael Potter <<A HREF="mailto:Michael%20Potter%20%3cmichael@potter.name%3e">michael@potter.name</A>><BR>
<B>Reply-to</B>: Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts <ale@ale.org><BR>
<B>To</B>: Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts <<A HREF="mailto:Atlanta%20Linux%20Enthusiasts%20%3cale@ale.org%3e">ale@ale.org</A>><BR>
<B>Subject</B>: Re: [ale] [OT] - Ethanol-free gas in the Atlanta area?<BR>
<B>Date</B>: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 21:33:03 -0400<BR>
<BR>
I have been using exclusively 10% ethanol since it become available in the early eighties. <BR>
<BR>
I bought a brand new 1987 chevy celebrity and put 170,000 miles on it. I always ran 10% ethanol from top tier gas stations. When I donated the car to some charity it still got great gas milage and did not use oil. I had the fuel injectors cleaned NO MORE than once. <BR>
<BR>
Since that time I have owned several cars and always run exclusively 10% ethanol. I have never had any engine problems. <BR>
<BR>
I really believe that running ethanol is not a problem on any car designed to run it. <BR>
<BR>
I will say this.... I had a convertible that would sometimes sit in the garage for a few weeks at a time. When it sat for over a week it would take a few cranks to start it. If I used sta-bil, it could sit for months and start on the first crank. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 3:47 PM, Courtney Thomas <<A HREF="mailto:courtneycthomas@bellsouth.net">courtneycthomas@bellsouth.net</A>> wrote: <BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
On 9/21/2013 10:41 AM, Ken Cochran wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm surprised there hasn't been mentioned on this list<BR>
(until now :) that ethanol gasoline is most efficient at<BR>
a different air-fuel ratio (umm, it needs to be richer<BR>
I think). I've always found it to run poorly (if at all)<BR>
in carbureted engines or even very old fuel-injected ones<BR>
(i.e. pre-early-'90s engines that can't adjust their fuel<BR>
mix ratios accurately/electronically). And we really can't<BR>
adjust the carburetors to compensate because the mixing jets<BR>
are/were usually factory calibrated & not adjustable (except<BR>
maybe for idle). Examples are *any* kind of outdoor power<BR>
equipment (mowers, trimmers, chainsaws, older (carbureted)<BR>
outboard motors, older (carbureted) inboard marine engines,<BR>
and of course antique vehicles. Ethanol gasoline works ok in<BR>
modern fuel-injected engines (albeit with decreased effiency<BR>
- they adjust themselves to enrich the air-fuel), and as<BR>
has been mentioned on this list, used enough that the fuel<BR>
"flushes through" & isn't stored for very long.<BR>
<BR>
Also, I don't believe I've seen *any* metal fuel system<BR>
component (other than a fuel-injector itself) on any vehicle<BR>
made since the mid-'90s (probably before, too). I might<BR>
speculate that this material change was for weight & lower<BR>
manufacturing cost but there's also corrosion resistance<BR>
(ethanol gasoline is corrosive to metals from what I've seen).<BR>
<BR>
Thought I'd toss that out I guess... :)<BR>
<BR>
-kc<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 07:56:57 -0400<BR>
From: Michael Potter <<A HREF="mailto:michael@potter.name">michael@potter.name</A>><BR>
To: Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts <<A HREF="mailto:ale@ale.org">ale@ale.org</A>><BR>
Subject: Re: [ale] [OT] - Ethanol-free gas in the Atlanta area?<BR>
<BR>
+1 Sta-bil<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 6:28 AM, Sean Kilpatrick <<A HREF="mailto:kilpatms@gmail.com">kilpatms@gmail.com</A>> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
**<BR>
<BR>
Yes, absolutely. Gasoline mixed with ethanol degrades quickly (think<BR>
weeks, not months.) The ethanol causes crud to form in aluminum carbs and<BR>
rots out the rubber fuel lines in small engines, especially two-strokes.<BR>
The carbs on these engines MUST be drained dry after each use to prevent<BR>
damage. I speak from bitter experience. :(<BR>
<BR>
The solution is simple: use ethanol-free gasoline and add Sta-bil to the<BR>
gas. A treated 2 gallon tank will last all summer.<BR>
<BR>
Sean<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
On Friday, September 20, 2013 02:48:11 am Jeff Hubbs wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
But is ethanol-free worth going out of one's way for for use with<BR>
lawnmowers and/or 2-stroke lawn equipment, especially when such<BR>
equipment sits idle for a few weeks or months at a time?<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
_______________________________________________<BR>
Ale mailing list<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:Ale@ale.org">Ale@ale.org</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">listinfo/ale</A><BR>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">listinfo</A><BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
--<BR>
Michael Potter<BR>
Tapp Solutions, LLC<BR>
Replatform Technologies, LLC<BR>
<A HREF="tel:%2B1%20770%20815%206142">+1 770 815 6142</A> ** Atlanta ** <A HREF="mailto:michael@potter.name">michael@potter.name</A> **<BR>
<A HREF="http://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelpotter">www.linkedin.com/in/</A><A HREF="http://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelpotter">michaelpotter</A><BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
_______________________________________________<BR>
Ale mailing list<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:Ale@ale.org">Ale@ale.org</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">listinfo/ale</A><BR>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">listinfo</A><BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
Ken,<BR>
<BR>
I have a couple of old Mercedes, a U.S. 1982 380SL, and a 1984 Euro 500SL, that are injected and have been using the ethanol stuff since it is the only practically available fuel<BR>
here in Alpharetta, to my knowledge, but have not noticed any problem for about 10 years now, but frankly, don't know if the fuel air mixture is electronically compensated.<BR>
They are both V8s by the way.<BR>
<BR>
What should I be on the lookout for, as I want no other and intend to be buried in one of 'em :-)<BR>
<BR>
Finally, any preventative suggestions ?<BR>
<BR>
Appreciatively,<BR>
<BR>
Courtney<BR>
<BR>
_______________________________________________<BR>
Ale mailing list<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:Ale@ale.org">Ale@ale.org</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">listinfo/ale</A><BR>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<BR>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/</A><A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">listinfo</A><BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
-- <BR>
Michael Potter<BR>
Tapp Solutions, LLC<BR>
Replatform Technologies, LLC<BR>
+1 770 815 6142 ** Atlanta ** <A HREF="mailto:michael@potter.name">michael@potter.name</A> ** <A HREF="http://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelpotter">www.linkedin.com/in/michaelpotter</A>
<PRE>
_______________________________________________
Ale mailing list
<A HREF="mailto:Ale@ale.org">Ale@ale.org</A>
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale</A>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at
<A HREF="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo</A>
</PRE>
<BR>
<TABLE CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="0" WIDTH="100%">
<TR>
<TD>
-- <BR>
Jay Lozier<BR>
jslozier@gmail.com
</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
</BODY>
</HTML>