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Jim,<BR>
This is a place where an ounce of initiative would be worth a ton of complaining. Where could a person get themselves hooked up with whoever maintains (or doesn't maintain) man pages?<BR>
I started working on developing a rewrite of some man pages for a few packages I use a lot, so the examples were at the top and not obscure. Many newbies believe foobar is a real linux command (I know from testing a couple hundred new linux users). Nobody has time to take on the man pages for 30000 packages, but if every one of us took on 1 or 2 of the man pages then the "F" in RTFM might be "fine", "fun" or "fabulous." What say you?<BR>
<BR>
-Wolf<BR>
<BR>
-----Original Message-----<BR>
<B>From</B>: Jim Kinney <<A HREF="mailto:Jim%20Kinney%20%3cjim.kinney@gmail.com%3e">jim.kinney@gmail.com</A>><BR>
<B>Reply-to</B>: Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts - Yes! We run Linux! <ale@ale.org><BR>
<B>To</B>: Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts - Yes! We run Linux! <<A HREF="mailto:Atlanta%20Linux%20Enthusiasts%20-%20Yes!%20We%20run%20Linux!%20%3cale@ale.org%3e">ale@ale.org</A>><BR>
<B>Subject</B>: Re: [ale] I am so tired of Linux Fanatics<BR>
<B>Date</B>: Thu, 8 Jul 2010 09:36:43 -0400<BR>
<BR>
My greatest "AH HA!" moment reading man pages was when I discovered I could search for terms within man pages by hitting /<search term> or /"search term" when it had spaces.<BR>
<BR>
And yes, release notes should be merged into the man pages as a "current version" section. I recently spent many days trying in vain to get a particular aplications client libraries to compile. Total fail. Turns out there was a blurb in a .2 version release notes that briefly pointed out the client libs were merged into the server libs and not needed as a stand-alone anymore. Since entire application had various version numbers for the different pieces, I had grabbed the latest of each. <BR>
<BR>
at least there _were_ release notes!<BR>
<BR>
eons ago (before SuSE drank the kool-aide and open-sourced their installer) I was tinkering with a SuSE installation issue. They had no release notes on their installer. They had notes on the distro but their installer was a black box. And it was failing to run on my chipset (that was about 2 years old so it should have been supported). End result is RedHat installed nicely and their notes on their installer covered the chipset initialization failure and provided a workaround (don't ask. It was like RedHat 4.2 era). Thusly, I wound up firmly in the RedHat camp since their output was more professional and robust and informative and open. And unlike the Debian installs at the time (which always worked - BTW) did not require that I know memory address space values (in hex of course) in order to accept a configuration during installtion. Granted, if I just hit "OK" on everything it all worked but it felt like a dead vertical learning curve while carrying a load of lead bricks by a cord in my teeth while climbing a greased rope that was on fire.<BR>
<BR>
And from that was born Ubuntu.... :D<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 7:34 AM, Paul Cartwright <<A HREF="mailto:ale@pcartwright.com">ale@pcartwright.com</A>> wrote: <BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
On Wed July 7 2010, Jim Philips wrote:<BR>
> The problem with RTFM is the assumption that the fine manual was well<BR>
> written in the first place. I have been using Linux since 1995 and I have<BR>
> always felt that the man pages were written in exceptionally poor fashion.<BR>
> The immediate underlying assumption is that you need to know about<BR>
> *everything* and that most basic functions of a command are beside the<BR>
> point. The man page for grep is an excellent example. They never go<BR>
> straight to the point. The high use examples are always buried somewhere<BR>
> that you would least be likely to look for them. The "F" in RTFM is not at<BR>
> all deserved. How can I find a file containing "x" in my home directory?<BR>
> The question will only be answered in the most convoluted way.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I forget the man page I was looking for once, but the option I was looking for<BR>
was somewhere in 3,000 lines of gobbledegook, and I couldn't find it.. some<BR>
of those man pages are just totally outrageous! This App I used to install<BR>
came out with a new version, and it didn't install right. I read the<BR>
installation guide backwards & forwards, with no help. I finally asked<BR>
the "GURU" and he said " oh, that option is listed in the release-notes!!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
--<BR>
Paul Cartwright<BR>
Registered Linux user # 367800<BR>
Registered Ubuntu User #12459<BR>
<A HREF="http://usdebtclock.org/">http://usdebtclock.org/</A><BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
-- <BR>
-- <BR>
James P. Kinney III<BR>
Actively in pursuit of Life, Liberty and Happiness <BR>
Doing pretty well on all 3 pursuits <BR>
<BR>
Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can’t be taken on its own merits.<BR>
Dan Barker, "Losing Faith in Faith", 1992 <BR>
<BR>
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