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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>One of my favorite Heinlein stories is
about a girl who gets knocked up by a stranger who swept her off her feet then
abandoned her. She has the baby and gives it up for adoption. Turns out she’s
a hermaphrodite and the pregnancy/birth has messed her up so much the doctor
gives her a sex change. Later as a young man he is approached by an older guy
who recruits him into the time police. One of the first things he does is
goes back in time to find the guy that knocked him up when he was a woman. He
can’t however, resist, having sex with his younger female self so it turns out
he’s the one who knocked himself up. After the female self gives birth he
takes the baby (a little girl) and puts it with the folks that raised him - as
it turns out the baby is him. After several years he goes back in time and
recruits his younger male self into the time police. He ends by saying “I
know who I am but where did all you zombies come from?”<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
ale-bounces@ale.org [mailto:ale-bounces@ale.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Jim Kinney<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, July 02, 2010 2:22
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Atlanta Linux Enthusiasts -
Yes! We run Linux!<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [ale] Servlets and
NetBeans and .jars, oh my!</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>But java is
self-documenting! All you need to do is run your working source code
through....<br>
<br>
yep! it's self-referencing closed loop process - to learn java is to know java
is to learn java is...<br>
<br>
It's like the watch in the movie "Somewhere in time" with Cristopher
Reeves. At a conference, an old woman gives him a pocket watch. He goes back in
time and gives that watch to her younger self. Who made the watch?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 2:03 PM, Dylan Northrup <<a
href="mailto:ale@doc-x.net">ale@doc-x.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>And it also seems that, whatever you're trying to do, there's not a
good, piece by piece tutorial for putting things together a bit at a
time. The HOWTOs and tutorials I've seen always seem to have a step that
goes something like the following:<br>
<br>
Step ???: Download the following jar files: <insert names of
several libraries author finds useful>. Now type out the code below
and magical stuff will happen because all the hard work is done by the
libraries you've downloaded in the trivial case I've outlined below that
doesn't cover what you want to be able to do.<br>
<br>
Ok, I admit, many times the author is not straightforward about admitting that
last bit, but it almost always seems to be the case. It's not that I'm against
useful libraries, but I've not found an author that a) introduces their libs
one at a time, b) gives a thorough description of the libraries they're using,
what the specific benefits are, c) provides more than one scenario for the
libraries they use or d) any combination of these.<br>
<br>
So, if you're trying to do exactly what the HOWTO author is doing, you're good
to go. If you want to do something else, the HOWTO doesn't cover it and,
depending on what set of libraries you've installed, you may have to jump
through an enormous number of hoops to be able to do something that seems like
a simple expansion on what the HOWTO covered, but isn't because the methods you
need aren't implemented in the libraries.<br>
</rant><br>
<br>
If someone can point me to the documentation or books I've been unable to find
that explain things clearly, incrementally and thoroughly (more than one or tow
use cases), I would be eternally grateful.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 12:08 PM, James Sumners <<a
href="mailto:james.sumners@gmail.com" target="_blank">james.sumners@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>I agree. It seems to me that this answer is really "depends on
what<br>
you're trying to do." In my case, I have to learn Java (the easiest<br>
part) + Libraries + Tomcat + whatever else is needed to run/administer<br>
my portal.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 11:53 AM, Dylan Northrup <<a
href="mailto:ale@doc-x.net" target="_blank">ale@doc-x.net</a>> wrote:<br>
> Actually, I think that'd be precisely the wrong place to start. The<br>
> tutorials there are presented on specific technologies, but are not put into<br>
> any overall context and there is nothing to tie the tutorials together or<br>
> show when and where they're supposed to be used. I know this because
I am<br>
> in the same position as Pete, have been looking for a similar "Guide
to the<br>
> Java Ecosystem" and found Sun's Java tutorials to be utterly lacking
in that<br>
> respect. Sun's site is great for learning how to implement the
specific<br>
> technologies, but not on why you'd want to implement those technologies,<br>
> IMO. YMMV.<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>--<br>
James Sumners<br>
<a href="http://james.roomfullofmirrors.com/" target="_blank">http://james.roomfullofmirrors.com/</a><br>
<br>
"All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts<br>
pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it<br>
is magnetic to the corruptible. Such people have a tendency to become<br>
drunk on violence, a condition to which they are quickly addicted."<br>
<br>
Missionaria Protectiva, Text QIV (decto)<br>
CH:D 59<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Ale mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Ale@ale.org" target="_blank">Ale@ale.org</a><br>
<a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale" target="_blank">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale</a><br>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<br>
<a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo" target="_blank">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<br clear=all>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>-- <br>
Dylan Northrup<br>
"Adversity is just change we haven't adapted ourselves to yet."<br>
- Aimee Mullins<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Ale mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Ale@ale.org">Ale@ale.org</a><br>
<a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale" target="_blank">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo/ale</a><br>
See JOBS, ANNOUNCE and SCHOOLS lists at<br>
<a href="http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo" target="_blank">http://mail.ale.org/mailman/listinfo</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br clear=all>
<br>
-- <br>
-- <br>
James P. Kinney III<br>
Actively in pursuit of Life, <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Liberty</st1:place></st1:City>
and Happiness <br>
Doing pretty well on all 3 pursuits <br>
<br>
Faith is a cop-out. If the only way you can accept an assertion is by
faith, then you are conceding that it can’t be taken on its own merits.<br>
Dan Barker, "Losing Faith in Faith", 1992 <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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